Ok so as a new guy to this I've took on the advice of "wait until the cold kicks in" to let the models settle down and then come to easier conclusions. So now the cold's here I'm non the wiser, the three main models seem to have been thrown off by the tropical cyclone Alex? Would I be correct in assuming that once this cyclone has passed up into Greenland, as predicted that model outputs should start to "settle" as such and be more of a close run thing? Cheers guys n Gals, I'm always lurching in the background learning massive amounts every day in here, keep up the great posts!