Flying Through A Thunderstorm

[Jane Louise]

Hi all,

I though it would be interesting to discuss the ins and outs of flying through a thunderstorm or even around it in that case!

I've found some snippets from various sources from the internet as shown below.

My question is: Has anybody ever observed a storm whilst flying in a airplane.If so what was it like to experience this?

Here are the snippets.

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It is unpleasant at best, dangerous at worst, to fly aircraft through thunderstorms, as lightning, hail, severe turbulence, vigorous updraughts and strong downdraughts all occur inside them. An aircraft can be wrecked by flying from a powerful updraught into an adjoining downdraught. Even the biggest of aircraft can be flung about the sky by the violent winds of vigorous cumulonimbus clouds. Pilots therefore try to fly around such clouds if they can. As the clouds are typically only 10-12 km across, this is normally possible.

Although passengers and crew may see a flash and hear a loud noise if lightning strikes their plane, nothing serious should happen because of the careful lightning protection engineered into the aircraft and its sensitive components. Initially, the lightning will attach to an extremity such as the nose or wing tip. The airplane then flies through the lightning flash, which reattaches itself to the fuselage at other locations while the airplane is in the electric "circuit" between the cloud regions of opposite polarity. The current will travel through the conductive exterior skin and structures of the aircraft and exit off some other extremity, such as the tail. Pilots occasionally report temporary flickering of lights or short-lived interference with instruments.

Hail competes with turbulence as the greatest thunderstorm hazard to aircraft. Supercooled drops above the freezing level begin to freeze. Once a drop has frozen, other drops latch on and freeze to it, so the hailstone grows - sometimes into a huge iceball. Large hail occurs with severe thunderstorms usually built to great heights. Eventually the hailstones fall, possibly some distance from the storm core. Hail has been observed in clear air several miles from the parent thunderstorm.

As hailstones fall through the melting level, they begin to melt, and precipitation may reach the ground as either hail or rain. Rain at the surface does not mean the absence of hail aloft. You should anticipate possible hail with any thunderstorm, especially beneath the anvil of a large cumulonimbus. Hailstones larger than one-half inch in diameter can significantly damage an aircraft in a few seconds.

Turbulence within even an isolated thunderstorm can be severe enough to exceed the structural integrity of an aircraft. Another aviation rule of thumb is that hazardous turbulence can be found in all thunderstorms. The strongest turbulence occurs with the shear between updrafts and downdrafts, but turbulence has been encountered thousands of feet above a storm and up to 20 miles laterally from a storm.

Airborne weather radar has generally not yet progressed to the point where it can "see" turbulence, but it can see the severity of the thunderstorm that will inevitably mean turbulence. Expect one with the other

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And here's a pilots instructions on the Do's and don'ts of thunderstorm flying.

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1. Don't land or take off in the face of an approaching thunderstorm. A sudden wind shift or low level turbulence could cause loss of control.

2. Don't attempt to fly under a thunderstorm even if you can see through to the other side. Turbulence under the storm could be disastrous.

3. Don't try to circumnavigate thunderstorms covering 6/10 of an area or more either visually or by airborne radar.

4. Don't fly without airborne radar into a cloud mass containing scattered embedded thunderstorms. Scattered thunderstorms not embedded usually can be visually circumnavigated.

5. Do avoid by at least 20 miles any thunderstorm identified as severe or giving an intense radar echo. This is especially true under the anvil of a large cumulonimbus.

6. Do clear the top of a known or suspected severe thunderstorm by at least 1,000 feet altitude for each 10 knots of wind speed at the cloud top. This would exceed the altitude capability of most aircraft.

7. Do remember that vivid and frequent lightning indicates a severe thunderstorm.

8. Do regard as severe any thunderstorm with tops 35,000 feet or higher whether the top is visually sighted or determined by radar.

[knocker]

I wouldn't say observed exactly. But 30 years ago a party of us flew from Prestwick to Memphis via Boston and Atlanta. Copious amounts of gin were consumed starting at Prestwick. To cut a long story short during the final leg from Atlanta to Memphis we went through a violent thunderstorm storm with the aircraft taking a huge buffeting. Fortunately the gin saved me from being terrified.

But one of the others in the party, a rather large chap, had passed out and during one violent plunge his false teeth flew out. I still have memories of two stewardesses and me and a friend staggering around looking for these teeth with lightning and all sorts goimg on outside. We eventually found them some yards away and normal service was resumed. Or nearly.................

That's a very shortened version.

[Jane Louise]

I wouldn't say observed exactly. But 30 years ago a party of us flew from Prestwick to Memphis via Boston and Atlanta. Copious amounts of gin were consumed starting at Prestwick. To cut a long story short during the final leg from Atlanta to Memphis we went through a violent thunderstorm storm with the aircraft taking a huge buffeting. Fortunately the gin saved me from being terrified.

But one of the others in the party, a rather large chap, had passed out and during one violent plunge his false teeth flew out. I still have memories of two stewardesses and me and a friend staggering around looking for these teeth with lightning and all sorts goimg on outside. We eventually found them some yards away and normal service was resumed. Or nearly.................

That's a very shortened version.

Interesting and scary to say the least weathership.

Thank goodness for the gin.

Thank you for sharing.

[Sprites]

On the way home from yugoslavia in 1990 ,soon after taking off from Ljibjuana airport ,cumulus and anvils were in view out the window, i pointed this out to the person next to me, they didnt believe me it was a thunderstorm, 20 mins later lightning was flashing below and to the left of the plane, very surreal and we had turbulance that knocked my inflight meal onto the floor, i was rather scared but was fascinated to be up there with the thunderheads!.

[Guest]

Some years ago we were en route to Perpignan and there was a thunderstorm at that airport - flashes of lightning and some buffeting - the pilot circled around a little bit and at one stage mentioned the possibility of diverting to Girona - however he found a 'clear' window which allowed us to land safely at Perpignan and everybody was happy.

Interesting experience.

I can't say that I was unduly alarmed since I was aware that lightning does not normally unduly affect an aircraft, because we were at a relatively low altitude icing would not have been a threat either and I take the view that pilots do not normally have suicidal tendencies - however hail could be - it has been known to deform the front windscreens of aircraft leaving them with a frosted appearance, rather like a bathroom window.

However thinking about it, it does bring on thoughts of the Air France aircaft out of Rio de Janiro which was lost in the Atlantic and I wonder whether more general icing affected its flight dynamics as well as blocking the pito tube. It would help explain the weird attitudes and manoeuvres.

[If Wishes made Weather]

Don't know if this is entirely relevant, but I remember flying from Denver to Tampa about 10 years ago on a very unstable day - multiple storms and tornados being experienced at ground level. Extremely rough ride even several thousand feet about the main action. Interestingly, on US flights it is possible to listen to the Air Traffic Control through the headphones, and the pilots were reporting back to the ATC the weather conditions/turbulance that they were experiencing and ATC were updating and updating the routing accordingly. Most unsettling when I heard our pilot reporting in and following flights being diverted from the path we had just taken.

[Thundery wintry showers]

I can't say I'd want to fly through the middle of a thunderstorm in view of the dangers of the aircraft being wrecked by the downdraughts/updraughts, but on the other hand I would love to see footage of what it looks like inside a cumulonimbus cloud. There are some Youtube videos of people flying through cumulonimbus clouds (usually on the very edge of them), but the camera's exposure tends to correct for the darkness giving the impression of ordinary fog.

My only flight was in April 2006 when the pilot took us around the edges of some cumulonimbus clouds but the nearest we got to flying into one was when we passed through a cumulus that was developing into cumulus congestus. It was notable that even that cloud was enough to generate some turbulence.

[shedhead]

Despite the #1 rule quoted above, the pilot of our plane decided it would be a good idea to take off out of Palma with at least 3 or 4 storms surrounding the airport. He must have made

the call based on the fact no individual storms were in his immediate flightpath, but if so he got that call very badly wrong, because we actually got struck whilst no more that 1000ft off the

deck. The lightning apparantly hit the wing on the port side of the plane, luckily we we seated starboard aft so never saw the contact, but it's fair to say those that did quickly discovered

adrenalin was brown and smelly! The incident put me off flying for some years and even now the wife still isn't keen over a decade later!

Edited January 15, 2012 by shedhead

[MP-R]

The only thunderstorm I have flown through was whilst descending towards Bristol Airport in July 2010. We approached from the northeast runway and had a rather bumpy ride around the south side of Bristol before coming out the other side at the airport. Saw a few flashes out of the window but it was daylight so nothing much.

Within the next hour, the storm backbuilt and eventually arrived where I live in Yatton (under the flightpath of the airport). Typically, this was one of only 3 storms in Bristol that year.

[Jane Louise]

Thank you, some interesting and of course nail biting recollections there . I personally wouldn't fly on a plane I fit in to the fear of flying category. How I would love to go abroad though! if ever I did it would have to go by boat... now that's another topic ,sailing through a thunderstorm at sea!

[Lauren]

Have flown through several thunderstorms now.

My first memory of doing so was on an old Tupolev to Bulgaria, there was several storm cells going on . The pilot said something along the lines of there being space to manoeuvre inbetween the various cells but that it would be very bumpy and it was. We were making quite a few turns and it was amazing to see all the different lightening around, many were different colours. As we were descending for landing we couldn't fly above it or around it, this made for a crosswind landing with the pilot being unable to decide which wheel to land on (or so it seemed!).

On the way to Thailand in a 747. The pilot said there was a huge storm system over one of the Stans. It was so big going around it would mean stopping for fuel so they wanted to go over higher to get out of the worst of it. If I recall we went to something like 47000ft which is at the very limit of it's altitude tolerance. I have certainly never been that high before or since. Even then we were still getting buffeted by the storm clouds. This was at night so the light display was out of this world. I can't be sure but several of us saw something that looked like a little mushroom cloud of light erupting from the top of the clouds. I am not sure if this was some sort of sprite, but it was certainly stunning.

Flying out of Croatia. There had been severe thunderstorms for a couple of days and we were concerned we would be delayed as the airport had been closed on and off with the passing storms. We were sitting on the tarmac ready to go for 45 minutes whilst they waited for a gap in the storms and then off we went. Bumpy is not the word. Lots of jolting and stomachs being taken away. Quite intense for 10 minutes, but then it was over. It was during the day so the storm couldn't be appreciated as much.

Finally not a thunderstorm as such. We were leaving Egypt just as the rains were arriving. I don't recall there being a thunderstorm but it was by far the scariest takeoff I've ever had and I enjoy turbulence! It was so bumpy the stewards were asked to sit back down and buckle up. there were several screams and we certainly dropped dramatically at one point, so much so for a split second I thought we were going down. It carried on like that for about half and hour and several people ended up in tears.

[Andy Bown]

After spending our honeymoon in Spain last summer with no cloud at all for 10 days we were surprised to arrive at Murcia airport in the late afternoon with cloud building and then soon after take off, at dusk, I saw a flash beneath us to the left of the plane. We then witnessed around 15 flashes as the plane flew past the storm below which was an awesome experience for me - it looks much different seeing the lightning high up in the cloud !

[Liam J]

I remember a few years back sitting in Corfu airport waiting for our flight home and watching a Thunderstorm kicking off pretty close to the airport, it had been sparked by high temps and high humidity around 38c that afternoon. We boarded the Thomas Cook Boeing 757 and the T-storm was very close to the airport by this stage and during the taxi to the runway I remember the pilot saying that it's going to be a rough take off as a result of the storm and we would be banking sharply as soon as we were airborne. He wasn't wrong, as soon as we lifted off the tarmac we made a sharp turn away from the island and my god the turbulence was quite scary, the look on some peoples faces and I remember watching the wing and engine bouncing up and down like mad! Thankfully it was short-lived.

[Guest]

Thank you, some interesting and of course nail biting recollections there . I personally wouldn't fly on a plane I fit in to the fear of flying category. How I would love to go abroad though! if ever I did it would have to go by boat... now that's another topic ,sailing through a thunderstorm at sea!

Jane,

What you have to remember is that being suicidal is not a normal trait of pilots - they are doing the job day in day out, often for decades until they get pensioned off. Aircraft are very well built and stressed to withstand the violent currents in a thunderstorm, so overall you are much more likely to be killed on the road than in the air and as the recent report of the ferry in Italy goes, sea travel is not totally risk free but again accidents here are very few and far between.

Look on llfe as a sexually transmitted fatal disease and enjoy the bit in between.

[Guest]

Don't forget the Met flights made by the US into hurricanes to enable them to get measurements and continue research into these.

Now that would be an interesting job.

Edited January 15, 2012 by mike Meehan

[Lauren]

Not to mention they get hit by lightening on a regular basis and don't crash.

[Alex95]

Twice last summer - we flew quite near to a supercell thunderstorm over South Carolina on the 21st July 2011 and experienced some moderate turbulence as a result, and the lightning was spectacular. Then on the 11th August we took off during a smaller thunderstorm in Orlando. Our flight had been delayed by 45 minutes, but the conditions must have improved sufficiently to take off. Again, it was quite bumpy!

EDIT: The one over SC was during the heatwave when all of eastern USA was experiencing temperatures over 100°F.

Edited January 15, 2012 by alza

[Guest]

However back on the ground - we had left Barcelona Airport and were on the motorway a few miles north when I saw some very ominous clouds ahead - talk about Cu Nimb - they were really nimb! - then it started raining with such force that the car immediately in front put on its hazards and stopped in lane 1 - I stopped in turn and put my hazards on as well and by this time all I could see of the car in front was just its hazards flashing - I was also in lane 1 but could not see the hard shoulder. The rain had reduced visibility down to virtually zilch.

After about 10 minutes it stopped to leave some hail at the side of the road - it was the most torrential rainfall I can ever recall seeing. Strangely enough I don't recall any thunder with this one.

[Interitus]

Yes, flying into Menorca on Friday 12/09/2008. Clear skies at cruising altitude across France to Pyrenees but having checked the forecast beforehand I knew that there was the chance for showers over the Balearics (Estofex level 2 risk) and the high shield of cirrostratus that cast shadow over the plane was an indicator of what was ahead.

Captain announced that there was a storm over the island which he was trying to avoid but soon we encountered quite violent turbulence - plenty of the normal shuddering accompanied by the stomach-in-the-mouth rollercoaster kind. Then a clear lightning strike to the wingtip, which was nice, though the shrieks of some passengers suggested that they didn't agree!

Eventually landed safely in torrential rain - the metars show that visibility was as low as 500 metres at one point, with the wind gusting to 92.6km/h (57.5mph)

http://www.wundergro...ilyHistory.html

According to reports three subsequent flights were diverted to Mallorca and 70mm of rain fell in around 20 minutes

http://translate.goo...%26prmd%3Dimvns

This report shows large hail and mentions possible waterspout/tornado (Cap de Fiblo)

http://translate.goo...i04YjZw8ZcJy6bg

Here are a couple of youtube videos showing conditions at the time and some subsequent flooding

[Jane Louise]

Yes, flying into Menorca on Friday 12/09/2008. Clear skies at cruising altitude across France to Pyrenees but having checked the forecast beforehand I knew that there was the chance for showers over the Balearics (Estofex level 2 risk) and the high shield of cirrostratus that cast shadow over the plane was an indicator of what was ahead.

Captain announced that there was a storm over the island which he was trying to avoid but soon we encountered quite violent turbulence - plenty of the normal shuddering accompanied by the stomach-in-the-mouth rollercoaster kind. Then a clear lightning strike to the wingtip, which was nice, though the shrieks of some passengers suggested that they didn't agree!

Eventually landed safely in torrential rain - the metars show that visibility was as low as 500 metres at one point, with the wind gusting to 92.6km/h (57.5mph)

http://www.wundergro...ilyHistory.html

According to reports three subsequent flights were diverted to Mallorca and 70mm of rain fell in around 20 minutes

http://translate.goo...%26prmd%3Dimvns

This report shows large hail and mentions possible waterspout/tornado (Cap de Fiblo)

http://translate.goo...i04YjZw8ZcJy6bg

Here are a couple of youtube videos showing conditions at the time and some subsequent flooding

Wow, that was certainly a bad storm.. thanks for sharing !

[Jane Louise]

An interesting piece from a pilot who's been flying for 45 years.. seems it was pretty scary for him in his younger days when he got caught in a thunderstorm.

Caught in a THUNDERSTORM By Tom Weeks

There must be a power that intercedes to protect young and foolish pilots from disaster. That power has interdicted several times for me in the past 45 years of flying. For instance, as a teenager, my early flying adventures took place over the long western shore of Lake Michigan . If the prevailing westerly winds sailed a thunderstorm into my flight path, I could usually skirt around the developing cells or quickly land to avoid being forced out over 100 miles of frigid, deep inland lake.

That didn't happen this time . .

My 150-mile VFR flight plan was simple, even for an inexperienced teenaged pilot: Just fly south along the shoreline from the glacial moraine of Door County to Milwaukee . Unfortunately, a squall line of thunderstorms darkened the western sky and was quickly bearing down on the airport. The airport operator knew I was a low-time pilot. He cautioned, " If it looks like this storm is going to cut you off, make a 180-degree turn and return to this airport."

With this advice in mind, I taxied out and took off in my recently acquired Cessna 140. I got cut off. I returned immediately to the airport vicinity. By now the boiling, dark clouds began demonstrating their strength. Strong downdrafts and random sharp gusts defeated my attempts for a safe landing and tiedown. A handful of seconds later, the airport disappeared under the rough-looking curtain. Then, the shore disappeared.

I found myself gazing bleakly at nearly 100 miles of open, ocean-blue water to the east (and nearly 300 miles to the south). I had no floatation safety devices on board. No ships or boats were in sight. I decided to climb and turn back toward the storm. Perhaps I could thread my way between the storm cells, then back to land. I carefully approached the storm's leading edge. Now, over the flat water the squall line was no longer stumbling over the trees and hills. Its violence appeared mollified. I was seduced into making an attempt to scale the wall of the cell.

By using the unbelievably strong updrafts, the Cessna was whisked up to 9000 feet. the aircraft was still climbing over 1200 fpm when an innocent appearing finger of cloud blocked its climbing turn. I thought, "I'll only be inside the edge of this cloud for a few seconds, then out the other side ". There was no other side . . but there was horror.

At what point did the sturdy 90 hp Continental's engine rpms "max out" ! Where did the terrifying airspeed peak as the pilot's side window was sucked out into the cell ! Who could know what damage thousands of marble-sized hailstones were rendering to the wings with the sound of the devil's snare drum !

http://www.fighterpilots.net/Stories/caught_in_a_thunderstorm.htm

[Coast]

http://youtu.be/lagZkdlaTqQ

[Guest]

A few stories here about people, mainly parachuitists being sucked into cu nimbs by the up draught:

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Cloud_suck

and

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/dead-luck-ewas-flight-of-fury/2007/02/16/1171405421626.html

Edited January 16, 2012 by mike Meehan

[stewfox]

When I was flying to India back in 1984 we went through a storm and the turblance was enough to knock trays etc all over the place not nice.

I assume they climb very high above 35,000ft to get over it ???

[Guest]

When I was flying to India back in 1984 we went through a storm and the turblance was enough to knock trays etc all over the place not nice.

I assume they climb very high above 35,000ft to get over it ???

You would need to go a lot higher than that in the tropics where I believe cu nimbs can get up to 50,000 feet or so.