38 replies to this topic

[Thundery wintry showers]

Yes, it's all very well saying "have less children", but the people who need to be having less children are mainly to be found in developing countries where birth rates are typically very high- in the more affluent parts of the world birth rates have declined leading to steady populations. It's not really applicable to us in the UK.

[Isolated Frost]

Towards the whole 'Save The Planet' and 'Make us Greener', I do my bit.

Not because I believe in global warming, as I think it's another phase, like the M. Warm Period and the Ice Age and Little Ice Age, I would just like the world to be a bit cooler!


I buy energy-saving light bulbs and solar panels, and I always make sure everything is off when not needed, so I'm happy with my current contribution.

[Ladyofthestorm]

Thats fantastic IF now we need another billion of peeps to do and think the same.

[Thundery wintry showers]

I admit that I haven't made any painful sacrifices, e.g. I eat out quite a lot, I eat meat almost daily, and while I don't drive and don't plan on having children, in both cases it isn't primarily for environmental reasons.

But on the other hand I have made plenty of painless, efficiency-saving cuts. I try to avoid leaving appliances, lights etc. on when I'm not using them, and I avoid using heating unless the indoor temperature is well short of 15C (which never happens in the UEA postgraduate residences anyway). I recycle everything I can (I know there are problems with the way recycling is carried out, but that's not the fault of those of us who recycle stuff).

Also, while those who eat out a lot have a reputation for wasting a lot of food, I'm very much the opposite- I take great care to avoid wasting food, and I'm confident that overall I only waste a small fraction of the national average.

[scottish skier]

Ladyofthestorm, on 27 October 2010 - 10:38 , said:

lol SS... I have four children, two from a previous relationship and new born twins from this one.

I think it is more the imbalance of population growth that is the problem... .

Sorry – think my comment from the other day was not quite what was expected for the thread!

However, it has a lot of truth – we really don’t need to add more people to the planet (4 kids - wow, I find one lots of hard work! ) unless we can find ways to feed and water them indefinitely. Education and reduction of poverty is the only way to do this, but that is a global issue…

Sure we can all do our own bit; I’ve fully gutted, insulated and re-plastered our (previously freezing cold) 1890’s cottage (what a difference in temp and bills), recycle/compost about 80% of our waste (largely all I can), drive a diesel which gives the best balance I can get for fuel economy versus power (or fun) and shut down everything I can when not needed.

If you read my posts in other threads, you’ll probably guess I’m a something of a sceptic - a least to a sensible, scientific extent - on the “we’re all doomed because of global warming” idea; rather I’m following the issue closely and carefully with as pragmatic an attitude as I can. Does not mean I don't think that we should all reduce dependence on fossil fuels and ‘reduce/re-use/recycle’ as this just makes sense – these are finite resources and won’t last forever.

Cheers,

SS

EDIT:

Oh, and Thundery wintry showers, I was not saying tell people they should have less children, just that it is a major issue; in the 'developed world' we are already doing that by circumstance, i.e. populations are growing now primarily only due to immigration. In less developed countries pop growth is a major problem - it is not the drought that kills (droughts etc are natural processes), but the fact that there are too many people relying on the same area of land/resourses/limited technology (this has always been the case; it is just now that we see it on the TV and so are more affected by it). There is no easy solution, other than to do our best to raise the standard of living for all and hope the population stabilises, unless we plan to start terraforming Mars...

Edited by scottish skier, 27 October 2010 - 21:04 .

[jethro]

How do you effectively reduce the population in developing countries without first class access to contraception? How do you effectively increase take-up of contraception when it runs counter to many cultures/religions?

Many, many women would rather not have baby, after baby, after baby but they have little, or no choice.

[Alan Robinson]

THERMAL INSULATION

Proper thermal insulation works wonders. I built my house in 2007 in accordance with the latest Danish building regulations, which means I have 38cm thick glass wool above, 28cm glass wool in the exterior walls, and I beefed up the underfloor to 40 cm polystyrene. The outside walls by the way are very resinous softwood from above the Swedish arctic circle, and the forest there is replanted 100%. The wood is a better insulator than masonry, and such structures are very durable, Sweden and Norway have thousands of very old timber houses.

It is is vital that a vapour barrier be fitted between the living space and the insulation. It prevents the moisture permeating into the insulation, thus reducing its efficiency considerably. Similarly, there must be a membrane between the roof tiles and the insulation to prevent small amounts of water blowing in in stormy weather.

I'm happy to say my gas bills are about 1/3 of my neighbour's.

Unfortunately, such effective insulation really is difficult to retrofit, and if your home is modest size can significantly effect what floor space you have.

GROWING YOUR OWN VEG.

I could go on at length about this, but suffice to say my garden provides all our garlic, onions, leeks, French beans, broad beans, peas, 3 kinds of cabbage, carrots, parsnips, beetroot and spinach. It also provides various lettuces between April and December, courgettes, ridge cucumbers (gherkins), Jerusalem artichokes, celeriac, potatoes, and fresh herbs for nine months of the year. I've just put up a little greenhouse, and in about 3 months I'll be sowing tomatoes and capiscum.

I never dig the beds, as I consider it bad for the growing medium. I just spread out a thick layer of compost mixed with very old seaweed meal, as we have tons of seaweed just down the road. Neither do I use pesticides, herbicides or synthetic fertilisers made from natural gas. Any nitrogen shortage is easily compensated by picking a bucketful of stinging nettles and soaking them for 2 weeks. The nettle tea gets very smelly, but is an excellent source of nitrogen. The seaweed provides more than enough phosphates and potassium, not to mention all the trace elements plants need.

Growing your own veg is wonderful, and must save a cartload of oil in transport.

STOP TRAVELLING

Its alright for me to say this, but there is far too much unnecessary travel. Try developing a larder so that most of the items you need are on stock at home. This means you don't have to drive to the shops so frequently.

TAKE GOOD BAGS WITH YOU TO THE SUPERMARKET

Stop accepting all those free plastic bags.

STOP BATHING AND SHOWERING EVERY DAY

My missus disagrees with me on this, and says I smell sometimes . She bathes daily. In my view, our skin is damaged by frequent washing with soap, and I shower twice weekly, or three times if she harps on about it. I'd like to think this reduces the amount of gas we burn.

[mike Meehan]

From an individual view I am wondering about the feasibility of having solar panels on the roof for heating water, which could be both for domestic and supplement the heating system.

With the future of the UK's energy supply looking some what problematic in the future and certainly more expensive I am further wondering about the feasibility of a backup- of photovoltaic panels. The main purpose of this being that the solar panel system would need electricity to power the pump etc. With the photovoltaic cells and batteries for storage it would mean that our house could be kept warm to an extent no matter what happened to the National Grid.

We have already gone a good way down this road with our newly renovated house in Languedoc, where we have solar panels on the roof, an air to air heat pump and a wood burning stove.

I suppose if the worst happened we always have the opportunity of going to France and sitting it out there so long as there is not a petrol delivery strike!!

Edited by mike Meehan, 01 January 2011 - 17:02 .

[mike Meehan]

From another point of view I am wondering why photovoltaic cells are not used on a more massive industrial scale in the deserts of the world.

If done on a large enough scale the electricity generated could be used firstly for domestic and industrial purposes, secondly it could be used to power desalination plants thus providing water for domestic, industry and crops and thirdly any excess produced could be exported to earn revenue.

Oil will run out one day and water in the drier areas of the world is becoming increasingly scarce so perhaps this could become a way of making the deserts fertile again.

Maybe it could also help stem the flow of immigrants to Europe - If the locals have water, food, industry and sunshine into the bargain why would they want to come to our cloudy overpopulated lands?

Perhaps the drawback will be politics and vaste stretches of photovoltaic cells will look unsightly.

Alan Robinson, on 28 December 2010 - 13:17 , said:

THERMAL INSULATION

Proper thermal insulation works wonders. I built my house in 2007 in accordance with the latest Danish building regulations, which means I have 38cm thick glass wool above, 28cm glass wool in the exterior walls, and I beefed up the underfloor to 40 cm polystyrene. The outside walls by the way are very resinous softwood from above the Swedish arctic circle, and the forest there is replanted 100%. The wood is a better insulator than masonry, and such structures are very durable, Sweden and Norway have thousands of very old timber houses.

It is is vital that a vapour barrier be fitted between the living space and the insulation. It prevents the moisture permeating into the insulation, thus reducing its efficiency considerably. Similarly, there must be a membrane between the roof tiles and the insulation to prevent small amounts of water blowing in in stormy weather.

I'm happy to say my gas bills are about 1/3 of my neighbour's.

Unfortunately, such effective insulation really is difficult to retrofit, and if your home is modest size can significantly effect what floor space you have.

GROWING YOUR OWN VEG.

I could go on at length about this, but suffice to say my garden provides all our garlic, onions, leeks, French beans, broad beans, peas, 3 kinds of cabbage, carrots, parsnips, beetroot and spinach. It also provides various lettuces between April and December, courgettes, ridge cucumbers (gherkins), Jerusalem artichokes, celeriac, potatoes, and fresh herbs for nine months of the year. I've just put up a little greenhouse, and in about 3 months I'll be sowing tomatoes and capiscum.

I never dig the beds, as I consider it bad for the growing medium. I just spread out a thick layer of compost mixed with very old seaweed meal, as we have tons of seaweed just down the road. Neither do I use pesticides, herbicides or synthetic fertilisers made from natural gas. Any nitrogen shortage is easily compensated by picking a bucketful of stinging nettles and soaking them for 2 weeks. The nettle tea gets very smelly, but is an excellent source of nitrogen. The seaweed provides more than enough phosphates and potassium, not to mention all the trace elements plants need.

Growing your own veg is wonderful, and must save a cartload of oil in transport.

STOP TRAVELLING

Its alright for me to say this, but there is far too much unnecessary travel. Try developing a larder so that most of the items you need are on stock at home. This means you don't have to drive to the shops so frequently.

TAKE GOOD BAGS WITH YOU TO THE SUPERMARKET

Stop accepting all those free plastic bags.

STOP BATHING AND SHOWERING EVERY DAY

My missus disagrees with me on this, and says I smell sometimes . She bathes daily. In my view, our skin is damaged by frequent washing with soap, and I shower twice weekly, or three times if she harps on about it. I'd like to think this reduces the amount of gas we burn.

Many years ago I recall spending a social evening in a wooden log cabin built in the woods on the ourskirts of Halmstad, Sweden which was reputed to be 1000 years old.

Edited by mike Meehan, 01 January 2011 - 17:24 .

[Alan Robinson]

mike Meehan, on 01 January 2011 - 17:00 , said:

From an individual view I am wondering about the feasibility of having solar panels on the roof for heating water, which could be both for domestic and supplement the heating system.

With the future of the UK's energy supply looking some what problematic in the future and certainly more expensive I am further wondering about the feasibility of a backup- of photovoltaic panels. The main purpose of this being that the solar panel system would need electricity to power the pump etc. With the photovoltaic cells and batteries for storage it would mean that our house could be kept warm to an extent no matter what happened to the National Grid.

We have already gone a good way down this road with our newly renovated house in Languedoc, where we have solar panels on the roof, an air to air heat pump and a wood burning stove.

I suppose if the worst happened we always have the opportunity of going to France and sitting it out there so long as there is not a petrol delivery strike!!

A fellah down the road from me has solar panels on his roof. I know from chatting with him that they only work between April and September when his house is fairly warm anyway.

On the other hand, there is an impressive solar heating system in Marstal, on the island of Ærø just south of us. it heats the swimming pool and provides 30% of the energy used in the small town's district heating system. They have addressed the energy storage problem using a 10,000 tonne reservoir. Here is a link, I'm sorry the thing is all in Danish, but on the other hand there are excellent pictures to give the idea

http://wk.bakuri.dk/...chure-DANSK.pdf

I dare not even think what the cost of this installation has been, but it must be enormous, and the meagre output compared to size says a lot about what is required when considering peak everything and our extravagant lifestyles.

Incidentally, reading the link, it seems one year they had a problem of excess heat in the summer. Water in the system began to boil and the saftey valves popped open. First they tried smearing whitewash on the panels to reduce the heating, but as that didn't work, they turned to pumping water through the panels at night time so they acted as a radiator, thus cooling the reservoir. The Marstal plant exclusively feeds the town's heating system between May and October, and they welcome visitors.

Edited by Alan Robinson, 02 January 2011 - 07:22 .

[Village]

I think most people know now that Green taxes are not used to make for a greener future. The word 'Green' is simply used as a vehicle to raise more tax revenue for the general pool. If it was about Green issues then the money would be ringfenced and spent on green projects. It is not, almost all of it is spent on anything but green projects.

[Alan Robinson]

Village, on 23 June 2011 - 15:42 , said:

I think most people know now that Green taxes are not used to make for a greener future. The word 'Green' is simply used as a vehicle to raise more tax revenue for the general pool. If it was about Green issues then the money would be ringfenced and spent on green projects. It is not, almost all of it is spent on anything but green projects.

Did you have any specific green projects in mind? Where I live (Denmark), politicians are very keen to promote the idea that they are the environment's best friends, and they certainly tax us until we squeal using the green tax argument. Yet despite peak everything - not least oil - the same politicians are mulling over where to build new motorways, and indeed, a Danish-funded tunnel or bridge project connecting Lolland to north Germany will soon get underway. Anyone would think that motorcars are here to stay.

Would you, for example, consider high-capacity data links a green project? It could be argued that such investments would make video conferencing more effective thus reducing the need to travel so much.

How about the re-introduction of short-sea shipping? The very smallest cargo ships carry the equivalent of ten to fifteen lorries for ten to fifteen times less fuel consumption. This would of course require that we re-establish a shipbuilding and repair industry to some extent.

Really, apart from protecting natural habitat from Homo sapiens' dogged encroachment, I struggle to see green projects that might significantly re-direct us towards a sustainable lifestyle. On the other hand, I am following with interest the Transition Movement, which is in fact a reaction to developments that are now way beyond our control........such as peak everything, debt as money, massive over-population. Hey, there's a thought..........a campaign for one-child families throughout the world would certainly be a green cause, though I doubt it would get much backing.

[mike Meehan]

Regarding transport we make far too little use of railways and a lot of items could go into containers, routed to hub, thence to finish off the journey by road, however certain road transport would need to be retained in the case of perishable goods, though this could be offset by growing such items more locally.

I did think about re-using the canal system for transport but a barge loaded with containers would be unlikely to get through many of the existing tunnels.

[Alan Robinson]

mike Meehan, on 16 July 2011 - 22:37 , said:

I did think about re-using the canal system for transport but a barge loaded with containers would be unlikely to get through many of the existing tunnels.

Mike, it wouldn't surprise me if some politician reading that comment suggest we dredge the canals......... .......... ......... we could then have a fleet of inland waterway cargo-carrying submarines......... . The dredged aggregates would come in useful for building new dykes in low-lying coastal areas vulnerable to rising sea levels. Is that permaculture I wonder?


Here's an idea.............how about watertight containers that could be towed through the canals? The ones full of winter jackets - and thus with a large freeboard - could be ballasted down to reduce airdraft.

Edited by Alan Robinson, 17 July 2011 - 04:31 .

[mike Meehan]

Alan Robinson, on 17 July 2011 - 04:22 , said:

Mike, it wouldn't surprise me if some politician reading that comment suggest we dredge the canals......... .......... ......... we could then have a fleet of inland waterway cargo-carrying submarines......... . The dredged aggregates would come in useful for building new dykes in low-lying coastal areas vulnerable to rising sea levels. Is that permaculture I wonder?


Here's an idea.............how about watertight containers that could be towed through the canals? The ones full of winter jackets - and thus with a large freeboard - could be ballasted down to reduce airdraft.

Naw, the best thing to do would be to work hard on those "Beam me up Scottie" machines from StarTrek - All transport problems solved, plus when shopping click on the appropriate item and it is instantly transported to your lounge etc

[Alan Robinson]

Alan Robinson, on 17 July 2011 - 04:22 , said:

Mike, it wouldn't surprise me if some politician reading that comment suggest we dredge the canals......... .......... ......... we could then have a fleet of inland waterway cargo-carrying submarines......... . The dredged aggregates would come in useful for building new dykes in low-lying coastal areas vulnerable to rising sea levels. Is that permaculture I wonder?


Here's an idea.............how about watertight containers that could be towed through the canals? The ones full of winter jackets - and thus with a large freeboard - could be ballasted down to reduce airdraft.

Someone must have been taking a peep at this thread......

http://www.bbc.co.uk...-leeds-14662402

[mike Meehan]

Alan Robinson, on 26 August 2011 - 04:23 , said:

Someone must have been taking a peep at this thread......

http://www.bbc.co.uk...-leeds-14662402

What I have been wondering is whether with all the spare aggregate we get we could dump it on the Dogger Bank - that way we could build up a fresh island in the middle of the North Sea - it won't do much at the moment but as it grows it could provide an overflow area for the expanding population - not only that it would help decrease the effects of the North Sea so that NE England and SE Scotland could get better* snowfall in the winters.

* Quality - not quantity.

Edited by mike Meehan, 27 August 2011 - 09:41 .

[Alan Robinson]

mike Meehan, on 27 August 2011 - 09:37 , said:

What I have been wondering is whether with all the spare aggregate we get we could dump it on the Dogger Bank - that way we could build up a fresh island in the middle of the North Sea - it won't do much at the moment but as it grows it could provide an overflow area for the expanding population - not only that it would help decrease the effects of the North Sea so that NE England and SE Scotland could get better* snowfall in the winters.

* Quality - not quantity.

Good idea, it is a terrible spot for small vessels in a gale. Start with the South West Patch, it is after all just 6 metres deep there, so it wouldn't take much work. I got caught out there in 1979 and got a real spanking for 20 hours as an upper level disturbance came through. That was one of the few times at sea I have ever taken all the rags down and gone below. If there had been an island I could have flung the hook, but instead I had to endure that awful steep and breaking sea.

[Weather Ship]

Solar energy at night offers bright future.

Seen from afar it looks like an enormous lightbulb on the end of a tower surrounded by hundreds of tiny mirrors. But, rather than being a flight of fancy, the Gemasolar plant in southern Spain is the first solar energy facility to supply power at night.

http://www.thetimes....icle3185441.ece